James Roland – Creator of Blood Drive!

John.output
[00:00:00] Kenric: Oh, during the cult of the spoiler verse and welcome back to sport in the country. I’m kinda creaking. That is mr. . And today on the show,
John: It’s a blood drive, man.
Kenric: guys, guys, guys, it is a blood drive. I’ve I’ve found a show, uh, spoke to me in ways I didn’t know were possible.
John: It spoke to me too, and I watched it immediately after you sent to me and Oh my God.
Kenric: It is so much fun. And if you have Saifai with the package of life, with the live TV package yeah. It’s available on Hulu.
John: Well, most of it’s.
Kenric: Yeah. For some reason, episode seven, nine and
11 are not, you have to get them, but you can, you can purchase them all on Amazon prime for two 99 per episode. There’s 13 episodes.
John: And there’s also a DVD set.
You can order out of Australia, which does work region freaks. They’re right on his website. It’s only, it’s only the show, but you could [00:01:00] do that if you want to as well.
Kenric: Yeah. It’s, I’m going to tell you right now. It’s totally worth it.
John: It is, it is. I mean,
Kenric: a lot of fun. It’s it’s in the Grindhouse to style
John: It’s crazy.
Kenric: it’s crazy. And it’s
cars that run on human blood.
John: I mean, you can leave it there and indistinct and just let everybody know that that’s not the most insane aspect of the show. It gets more insane. It’s amazing. You should watch it.
Kenric: Yeah. It’s so much fun. There’s a character named Julian slink and is one of the greatest characters. Oh God, the guy that plays him is just
John: Oh, he’s fantastic. He was funny. I didn’t like him at first. At first I was like, Oh, this is, I thought it was over the top. Yeah. But then as like, by the second episode was like, Nope, I love
Kenric: It’s like the mask and V for vendetta, it’s annoying at first.
John: But then you’re like, Nope, this, this is perfect.
Kenric: it goes, it’s like the mask is everything. And Julian, since slink the character, he [00:02:00] just moves the story along in such a wonderful way that you just can’t help, but love him and him and hate him.
John: Right. And it’s perfect. And we had the chance to talk with the creator of the show.
Kenric: Yeah, James Rolin came on and the guy is awesome. And we
John: Look away for us
Kenric: local boy yeah. Out of Tacoma and then grew up in , which is a small town. And you probably never heard of that town unless you’re from Washington state.
John: as you’re from this part of Washington state.
Kenric: Yeah. So let’s get into this interview because James is awesome. Blood drive is awesome. And I think if you’re listening to this, hopefully it’ll.
You know, make you
John: I want to go out and actually purchase
Kenric: watch it because it’s not good.
John: It is amazing.
[00:03:00] Kenric: Hey guys, welcome back. Uh, today. We’re so lucky. Because, so a couple of weeks ago, I’m w I’m on Hulu and I’m like, God, I need something to watch. And I’m looking, I’m looking, and I see this things as blood drive, and I’m like, what the fuck is this? And I, and I watched the trailer and I’m like, Oh my God, I’m in 100%.
I’m in like San, I start watching it. I tell Johnny about it. And he goes, what the hell is this? And he goes, I gotta watch this. And. We had to look it up and we’re lucky enough to have the creator, the writer, James Rolen of blood drive, uh, which I’m sure a lot of the guys that are listening to this [00:04:00] program now are well aware of it, even though I was I’m a Johnny come lately, but I’m glad I did James.
Thanks for coming on.
James Roland: Dude. Thank you so much for having me. I love talking about the show.
Kenric: Yeah. And it’s, it’s a, it’s a tour. It’s a sight to behold. It’s that way. I always, when people go, what? So what, how, how is it? I’m like. It’s crazy fun. That’s how it is.
John: Okay.
James Roland: it’s crazy for sure. Yeah, no, it’s kinda nuts. I wouldn’t, we, um, Uh, David straighten, who directed the first two episodes, uh, in the last two. And he was a producer on it, um, in DGA rules, like they get to do the first cut themselves and I wasn’t allowed to see it, you know, according to like union rules. And, uh, and he came up and I was like, dude, how is it?
And he’s like, lost in thought. I said, I was like, be honest, what do you snake? He goes, honestly, he just goes, well, It’s like getting hit in the face with a machine gun.
John: That is
James Roland: That’s like, is that good or bad? He goes, I don’t [00:05:00] know. I don’t know what we’ve done. Um, well, instead of this show at the show, it’s pretty, man. It moves at a clip. It’s really crazy.
Kenric: Oh, I absolutely love it. Matter of fact, is I just finished? I just finished it today.
James Roland: Oh, you did? Oh my gosh. Oh man. So
Kenric: Yeah. I mean, I’m not kidding. I had never, I can’t believe I’ve never heard of it.
John: Yeah, me too.
Kenric: cause it came out in what, 2017. And I’m like, how did I not know about the show? This is right up my alley. I love
James Roland: well, welcome to my world, man. That’s why we got canceled. You want to believe I still, I still get people on Twitter going where as this been my whole life. And I’m like, I tried to give it to you. Um,
John: I sent over to my friend at work today and he watched the first 10 seconds of the trailer and he goes, I, man, this is my view of everything.
James Roland: Yeah, that’s a whole other story. I mean, we had a ton of views on our, on our trailer when it was coming out and we had mostly digital promotion. It was a low budget, very low budget show. one of those. One of the lowest budget shows on scifi. And so it did, it didn’t have a lot of promotion budget because of that, but we [00:06:00] were, so we had a, like a large online presence for like the trailers and things and it just didn’t transfer over into live views network.
Yeah.
Kenric: bummed because I don’t understand how that show could not be a success.
James Roland: I don’t understand that
Kenric: is so much fun. And then you guys have awesome people. Alan Richardson. I mean, come on.
James Roland: He’s incredible. Yeah.
Kenric: Christina Choa, you can’t get a prettier girl that can actually act as good as her.
James Roland: And kick ass. And as I found out after knowing her for 10 minutes, a Mensa member, like she’s a genius.
Kenric: yeah, that’s
James Roland: She’s just like the smartest, kindest, most amazing empathetic person. And she likes. Came with a whole journal on grace and she goes, she goes, I have all these ideas for a backstory. Like, what’s your idea for a backstory?
Cause I’ve already like written volumes on her. Like she’s just like really? Yeah. She just, she just, yeah, she was amazing.
Kenric: Oh, that’s awesome. She was, she was so good when she, when I first saw the trailer, I, you almost think that she’s going to be another, like, [00:07:00] I dunno, cliche, I guess the best way to say it. And then you watch that first episode and you’re like, Oh my God, that chick’s a star. She’s amazing. I want to see more of her in a bunch of different roles.
James Roland: I know. I’ll stay here. She’s yeah, she’s incredible.
Kenric: Now Alan’s gone on and he’s doing a hock with Hawk and dove on Titans. Titans. Yeah.
James Roland: Is always in that
John: and he was Aquaman on Smallville. Alright.
James Roland: Yeah. He’s got that. Yeah. No, he’s, he’s always a super, he kind of a superhero in, um, in blood drive too. He can, he plays like these larger than life kind of character. Cause he’s yeah, no, he’s the
Kenric: can’t, we can’t talk about the last, like three episodes. Cause Johnny hasn’t had a chance to finish him yet.
James Roland: Oh my God.
Kenric: I
John: I’m not, I tried my best to get done today, but God, you got to see whatever you want. I’m going to finish it probably tonight or tomorrow. I just had worked that got in the way.
James Roland: No, there’s really, there’s really stuff I don’t want to. I worked so hard to protect.
Kenric: Oh, dude, the old man twist was brilliant. James.
James Roland: three doesn’t know about it.
Kenric: Not yet. Yeah, but that’s not gonna, that’s not gonna ruin. I’m just, I have to tell [00:08:00] you that was brilliant because I was not ready for that. I was like, what, what
James Roland: I’m so glad. I’m so glad it worked. I was so terrified. People would figure it out. And actually there
Kenric: no way
James Roland: one person that did on up. Slack jaw punks that podcast out of D out of Detroit, um, are amazing guys that are like big supporters of the show. They, um, and they, as a joke, he goes, what if this?
And he called, he called it the day. I was like, and I
Kenric: really are a punk.
James Roland: and I laughed. I was like, yeah, that’s the dumbest theory of whatever I played it down. And then when the episode aired, he was like, you lied to me. I sent him for guessing it. Right. I sent him in the mail. I had one of slinks top hats and
Kenric: Oh.
James Roland: it to him in the mail as was like you son of a bitch.
You actually guessed the twist.
Kenric: Oh man. Slink, the guy that plays slink is, um,
James Roland: Colin Cunningham,
Kenric: yeah, I call him Cunningham and he was, did he work with, uh, what’s his [00:09:00] name? Oh man. He had that far falling skies.
James Roland: all these guys was
Kenric: plays Pope.
James Roland: Oh, and we only sky’s is kind of the reason we got it, because if that had ended and he had done five years on that and had made a good chunk of money and it was kinda like going to take some time off and just find something he really liked and unbeknownst, unbeknownst to him what was going on or know that had come to him and he didn’t, he didn’t want to take it at first.
He was mulling it over. We’re going out to other people and get into it. And we got turned down. He turns in, he finally read, he reads it and he’s like, they only don’t have a lot of money because we couldn’t afford it because we were so low budget. And, but he was kinda like, I don’t really care about money cause I have a big chunk of money.
I want to do something really interesting and different and he almost didn’t. Audition. He was like, this is, is this too weird? I don’t know. Like, you know what I mean? It was just either people either really got it right away. Or they were like, [00:10:00] Oh, and he went to his parent’s house. He told me this story. I went to his parents’ house and he’s hanging out with his dad and it’s like officing.
And he looks up and there’s a box even like never noticed before up in like the den. And he goes, what’s in that box. And he goes, Oh, it’s up, hat tackle it down. And he pulls it down and it’s a top hat and, and Collins, very kinda, you know, Uh, I won’t speak for him, but I don’t, I’m not a spiritualist or whatever, but he’s teaching, he listens to the universe kind of like any kind of way.
Yeah. He was like, that’s kinda weird. So he took the hat and he made an audition tape. That is the best thing I have ever seen any. He audition. And I, and we went to John Lavin who was a producer and show running it. And I was in, I was in, we had a cast that really, I was already down in Africa where we shot it.
We shot it in South Africa. And I was already down there on the other side of the world. And I’m going, John, just the guy, because she had this genius, the audition tape, dude, it opens with him standing in shadow in the back of the room. [00:11:00] And he steps out like into a spotlight. Like he lit it any, any, any opens his mouth and grins and he had just taken up, puff up a cigarette.
And so. All the smoke came out of his mouth, like a dragon, like it was like on like head into a shells and we submitted it to the network and they were like, no. And, and
Kenric: How do you say no to that guy?
James Roland: right. And then we had to put an offer out to somebody else. And I woke up with stress dreams that night and I was like, yeah.
And they didn’t thank God. They’re a good actor. I won’t say who they were a really good actor, turned it down. And I was like, I’ll think of it. And, and, and I said, we have to go to this guy again. And then we were told, no, you absolutely cannot. So I went to my, I went to like another choice that was slightly better than the last one.
And they said, no, that person turned it down.
Kenric: Oh, man.
James Roland: We in the end, we’re now up against the line. So there was pressure, there was pressure on the studio to say yes to somebody. And so I, I went back to the, like the show runner and I said, I will. I talked to my wife first. So like, make sure it was okay with her.
[00:12:00] But I, I, I said, I will devote some of my salary to this guy, if we need more money. Like, like I was like, he just, there was no show without this guy. I’m convinced he’s the guy. And you know, they obviously, they didn’t do that. They kind of whatever, but they. It wasn’t passionate enough or they found some way, whatever.
And the next thing I know, he’s on a plane down to South Africa,
Kenric: Oh, that’s
James Roland: um, and, and changed my life forever. He’s such an amazing guy. And, and, and he, even to this day, I’ll talk with him and he’s like, James, I’ll never have a role like that again, like it’s, it’s
Kenric: He played that role. So well that there’s times when you’re like, what a scumbag and then at the same time, you’re like, I absolutely love this man.
James Roland: you root for
Kenric: Yeah. And you root for him. Exactly. And it’s just like, Oh, and he’s such, I don’t know the character that you created and the, and the fact of how everything kind of evolves and at the end, what happens?
Um, man, have you ever thought of pulling it into a comic book?
James Roland: I have. Yeah, no, I have people have talked about that. That [00:13:00] problem is this, um, is that I don’t have the rights, the rights are owned by universal and we attempted to buy them back and all,
Kenric: Even for the comic books, huh?
James Roland: If I may, I, we could theory as possible. They’d be like, okay, but we’d have to go find the funding. We have to put all of that money up
Kenric: Yeah. I saw your post from, I don’t know when you, when you wrote it, but saying you and you basically said the same thing, universal owns the right it’s you know, we’re going to try to buy him back so he can shop a season to somewhere else because I would love to see blood rock. Um, but it’s man,
James Roland: Yeah. And it was, you know, it was near, it’s a weird thing. Like on the one hand I was like, really so bummed about that. On the other hand, like they’re the only ones that took a chance on the script. Like that script, when it went around.
Kenric: I mean, you got to made, you got it made.
James Roland: got to make. Yeah. Everybody else, every media ever had about that script was like, we love this.
We’re not gonna make it, but we love it. And, and, and it was like, well, great. Then why are we talking? You know? And, and, and Saifai bought it. They bought it directly. I sold it directly [00:14:00] to the network and they, so they took the risk on it. So it’s weird. It’s like, it’s like, I love them. I will love them forever for that.
Um, but I would love to have my show back, but, but then the other on the other side too, with the comic and the comic would be amazing. I’m not, I’m not gonna lie. Some of the things we would get to do, but then there’s also a part of me and it’s like, I want to work with those actors again. I want, I want those, you know what I mean?
It’s hard to imagine.
Kenric: I could listen to slink, just read the phone book.
James Roland: Yeah. That’s the thing. How do you link looks like, yeah. It’s like, I can’t imagine anybody else’s
Kenric: I like it. You know, if someone in this group had watched all of them, I could, I could tell you my ideas of how things could happen, but wouldn’t ruin it for somebody else.
John: I’m sorry, guys.
James Roland: Yeah, I
John: me to, I can leave for a few minutes. You guys want to talk about it? It’s fine. I’ll go outside real quick.
Kenric: No.
James Roland: So anyway, I, yeah, no, I’ve thought a lot about a comic and it’s, I think it’s just not, not in the cards right now. Like right now I’m trying to get another ship going and stuff. It doesn’t, [00:15:00] you know, so yeah, it
Kenric: got a lot of talent, man. I don’t, I can’t see you not doing, working on something. Cause cause now you’re working on the purge and what does that like? How’s that going?
James Roland: it’s kind of amazing, like, like a plane in somebody else’s sandbox. And it was like being a fan of the movies. It was surreal to kind of go, Oh my gosh, like I’m getting to like, come up with purchase stories and pitch ideas to like expand purge lore and the mythology. And that was pretty cool. And then, um, James DeMonaco created it and, um, His producing partner, Sebastian Lamar, CA they’ve done all the movies.
And so to get to sit in a room and talk with them about like, where could it go? And like, how would the bulls work off season and stuff? Cause we got to do the cool thing of like season two of the purse takes place in between purges. So you get to see kind of like the psychological fallout of the blood bath.
And so that was a really cool, it was, you know, very obviously. It was really different, even from the movies. It was more of like a [00:16:00] 1970s, psychological thriller, because the premise was that if you could do all your killing on courage, well, you know, the NFFA doesn’t want you to kill, you know, it will crack down, extra hard on the rest of the year to kind of maintain those.
If a near that like the per day actually makes things better. So like, Yeah, like corporal punishment and like all of these things, like it’s a more totalitarian society and so you can’t do anything wrong. And so we had to create, we had to craft a purge, so we’re no one’s allowed to kill.
Kenric: Oh, interesting.
James Roland: Yeah. And so it was at first it was like, Oh my gosh, can we do this?
But I, they ever, I think creatively we’re really, really happy with the show and the studio was and stuff. So see, it’s really different from the other purge movies and stuff. So anyway, yeah. Yeah, that was a really cool experience. Very different than blood drive. Cause it was all restraint,
Kenric: Yeah. We’re blood drive is just like visually stunning. You know, that you’re just like, how did you, I have a question actually. How do you get away with the Gore and the language? And then I noticed like the blurriness, like, [00:17:00] you know, when, when he stands up and his Dick falls up in his Dick’s there, but it’s all blacked out and it just
James Roland: The black, the black bars,
John: the black boxes
James Roland: bars were an early, I was like, Basically, I guess, I don’t know the certain lives in a weird space where it’s like, we’re, Hey, we’re going to be exploitation. We’re going to be like exploitation films, right. But
Kenric: Yeah. Greenhouse.
James Roland: also, but we’re also for basic cable. So it was like, but I was like, if we pull our punches, everyone’s going to call bullshit.
Right. If we’re like, look we’re exploitation and you know, Teehee, here’s an inch of cleavage or whatever it is. So we were like, okay, we really have to push those boundaries. And that means you, we’re going to push you guys, you know, meaning the studio and you’re gonna have to. Demand, you know what I mean?
But at first it was like, they’re going to have the black bar, but then it was stupid and then they could do whatever we want. So we basically would agree to black bar what they absolutely mandated. We black bar, um, and I wanted the black bar instead of blur [00:18:00] and cause
Kenric: It was so funny though.
James Roland: old school. Yeah. And then it led to, you know, and a lot of people are like, was everything naked underneath it?
Well, it’s like the, the erection joke in episode two or whatever it was, you know what I mean? Like. Or three or four or whatever it is. Well, it must’ve been some dream it’s like, no, did we have a guy on set with a full Russian? You don’t know that, but that was something like in post production, they did it as a jet, a gag.
And I laughed so hard because her line is like, must have been some dream and she’s reacting to how he’s, you know, how he’s behaving. But if you put that black bar on hand, so it looks like he has a foot long erection. It’s like, Funnier. So that one was obviously bullshit. Like, did we have somebody with an erection that no, but I mean, it was hilarious.
So, um, so they’re not all real in that regard, but we did. Yeah. I have a lot of nudity and push those boundaries. They, they basically like, they pushed back a few times, but by the time we got to episode five with like the radioactive zombie seaman and, uh,
Kenric: so gross, man.
[00:19:00] James Roland: right. And,
Kenric: The like bus.
James Roland: the stock bus. We, I, and I’m not joking like that.
We , we got an email from standards and practices and they said, you need to give us an extra couple of weeks because it broke up. They didn’t know how to, they just broke up. And, um,
John: Zombie just broke him.
James Roland: They did every, and then after that, they kind of let us get away with anything and they quit pushing back on language.
They just were kind of like, all bets are off. They just kinda look right. Um, and there was a moment on set shooting episode five, cause we actually filmed that, um, all of that goo is practical. Uh, obviously, and it actually glowed, it was the whole set was lit with black lights. So all of that, we enhanced it a little bit in certain shots, but all of that glowing tongue, glowing eyes, glowing goo that’s all.
That’s what it was like on set. It was, and it was like three days shooting, a black light orgy. And I [00:20:00] remember.
Kenric: it’s so funny.
James Roland: Drinking, the Koolaid man, we were, we were all just kinda like off the reservation, like making this weird shit down in South Africa so much fucking fun. It was so fun. And every day was like that.
It was just like, I can’t even, I can’t even explain what it was like. It was the most fun I’ve had in my entire life. And
Kenric: you know what scene made me laugh? And I mean, I’ll just start like the other day. I just started thinking about it. Cause I knew you were coming on and I just started laughing again and I couldn’t wait to ask for it. Who came up with the idea when Arthur is fighting and I love how she calls him Barbie through the whole thing.
When he’s fighting, I think it’s in the first episode and he goes to punch the guy, the guy moves and he just changes upper cuts. That old lady, and all you see is her shoes. Cause he knocks her out of her shoes. I lost it.
James Roland: That is that’s episode five,
Kenric: Oh my God. Whoever thought that was genius.
James Roland: boiler alert. She comes back. That was, um,
[00:21:00] Kenric: Oh, that was funny too.
James Roland: Danny Zucker and, um, inherit and, and Harrison Weinfeld who wrote that episode. I think that that was in their outline or in their script. I don’t think we had come up with that cause you outlined really extensively the main beats and stuff.
And then a lot of that extra juice. We not, every show is run the same way, but the way we ran it is we were like, guys, we want your sense of humor because every episode was a different genre. So we’re like, you’re never going to get another opportunity as a writer to kind of do want, usually you have to write to the voice of.
You know, the show creator, cause it’s all has to be very similar, but I was like, this show breaks, those kinds of rules, you know, like I’ll, I’ll rein it in if it’s too far, but you do, you act. And I remember getting that script and going, like, he’s not so granting out of it. Like it was, but I was like, is it too stupid?
Like, is it a too corny? But like, and then.
Kenric: so funny.
James Roland: It really turned out well, and [00:22:00] they, and they had, like, they had to like put her shoes on the ground and that, that shot students are still, there was like, Oh, I’m glad you liked it. That was one of those things where I was like, is this the woman?
Kenric: I lost it. Cause you see everybody go, Ooh, whether they pan they pander just her shoes, but I just lost it.
James Roland: the fact that she likes it, she’s like all happy is so weird. It’s so weird itself.
Kenric: rewound that scene three times. I couldn’t stop laughing.
James Roland: And the look on his face, like, Oh, I went to, and everybody acts like things have been killing people left and right. But that was too far, but it’s going to be okay. It’s hilarious.
Kenric: man. When they bring her back and he knocked her out in the wheelchair, I was like, Oh my God. That is awesome.
James Roland: Those are the same guys who wrote that episode. So they brought the grantee back.
Kenric: Well, if you get to talk to him, tell him we got fans, man. They loved that scene.
James Roland: they did such a good job.
Kenric: So you [00:23:00] actually were, uh, had some things with the risk cutters. I love story.
James Roland: Hmm.
Kenric: And we started talking a bit before we actually got into this interview and the amount of people that are on that movie, which was, we’ll say it was ambitious. I think that was the word that was used.
James Roland: yeah.
Kenric: the cast is amazing.
James Roland: Yeah. Yeah. I was working with will Arnett and Nick Offerman. And before I knew who they were like, I, and I literally, I remember seeing them on TV, like years after and going, like they looked familiar and then like, but not putting it together, you know? Um, that, yeah, because yeah, I know, but they’re, they’re great in it.
They’re funny. Yeah. I’d say it’s a weird, it’s a weird little movie.
Kenric: Yeah. And Tom waits is in it as well, which is crazy.
James Roland: yeah, he’s crazy. He’s amazing genius, but he’s. He’s crazy. He keep came on that movie and he, this is the story I was told. So I don’t know how it is heretical, but knowing him, I’m sure it’s true. He goes, I’ll take the role, but I have to have a Turkey in my [00:24:00] scenes.
I have to have fireworks. I want to do something with fireworks and I don’t, I’m going to drive a Lark, you know, like the motorized car that like old people, you know, like Delta get around.
Kenric: Yeah.
James Roland: And they were like, we need to Tom white. So they said yes to everything. So like literally we had to have a Turkey, he’d be in a scene.
There’s just a Turkey walking in the background that was like a boost. I think it was a Turkey. And it was like, why did you don’t know? You didn’t question? And he would like come to do a C and he goes, I’m just going to try something. And so the scene where he’s introduced in that movie got two great stories about him.
This one, where he was like, He didn’t, he’s like, I’m not so sure about this dialogue. I don’t want to say this dialogue and that the scene was that the dragging along at night and he’s sleeping in the middle of the road and they almost hit him and he stands up and says something and then they go off with him and he’s part of the story.
And, um, and, and, and I, eh, and he was like, I don’t want to say this dialogue. And they were like, okay, well, let’s find something, you know, that you want to say. And he goes, I just let’s just shoot the scene. I’ll figure it out. [00:25:00] And so they just filmed not knowing what he was going to say. So they, you know, whatever do the shot that you drive up or whatever the lights are on him.
And they’re all like, Oh my God, are you okay? We almost hit you. And like, that’s what the scene is. He kind of like stands up and he’s like doing his job Tofino, Tom waits thing where he’s kind of shit, you know, moving weird. He stands up and he goes, he goes, man, I fell asleep, all weird to my ears. Look asymmetrical to you.
Like that was a lie. And we’re like dying, laughing. And we’re like, who comes up? Like, what does that even mean? They left it in the movie. It was genius, but it was like, Do my ears look asymmetrical to you. Um, and then my other funny now, but at the time frustrating story with Tom waits was he had, they’d given him all these fireworks and you can carry them around.
And they were like the black cats, like the long strings of, you know, it’s sound like machine gunfire, those ones. And there was a scene where his character, his character in that movie runs a camp and it, all of these people live in the camp. He’s like, [00:26:00] everyone come this way. We’re going to watch a movie or do something.
I can report it. Wasn’t just come this way. And you know, I’m an assistant director, so you’re wrangling the background. And so we’re giving them cues, okay, go, not go, you know, walk towards him in the scene. As they walk towards him, like 50 extras, she starts lighting, fireworks and throwing them at them.
John: Jesus.
James Roland: I’m like, like, not as a Melissa, but we’re like, he’s just crazy.
We’re like, I don’t think anybody’s going to die. I’ve had to gut it right in the eye or something. Like, it can be dangerous. Right. But like, Not safe. And so I start yelling like, absolutely not. And then my assistant director who was consequently fired, my boss starts yelling at me. Like you send those backgrounds like into the fireworks.
And I’m like the most unsafe thing I’ve ever seen. He was pure chaos. And in the middle of it is Tom Kathleen and throwing fireworks, like at poor people that are like, what is going on. So those are my, those are my risk cutters stories.
Kenric: man.
James Roland: Hopefully somebody doesn’t get [00:27:00] sued
Kenric: right.
John: Hopefully not.
Kenric: That’s pretty cool though. I mean, getting work with Tom waits and I mean,
James Roland: What a genius, right? Like, yeah. That’s a special memory.
Kenric: yeah, I mean, it’s just like, Who else was on that movie? I mean, you have will Arnett and Abraham. Uh, what’s the, how do you say his last name? Ben Ruby.
James Roland: Oh yeah. Who’s in
Kenric: on, uh, Parker Lewis can’t lose.
James Roland: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He goes all the way back then. Yeah. Yeah. No, right.
Kenric: is funny is we just had corn Nemic who played Parker Lewis on not too long ago.
James Roland: Oh, that’s awesome. That’s really cool.
Kenric: That guy worked with everybody.
James Roland: Yep. No, he has a
Kenric: got stories with working with a. What’s his name? Martin Landau. And you know, while he was on Tucker. So he’s worked with everybody on that movie. It was ridiculous. How was that? Mark Boone?
James Roland: Margaret, uh, I don’t remember Mark
Kenric: Oh, he’s, he’s a great character actor. He was in risk cutters. He’s a great character actor. And he was in, uh, do you ever watch, did you watch the Mandalorian [00:28:00] by chance?
James Roland: Oh, yeah. Well, it’s not, yeah. It’s not like four episodes. Who was he in the Mandalorian?
Kenric: He was the guy that he demanded. Lorian go, Mondo goes to that base, like say like just out in the North space.
James Roland: Yeah. Yeah.
Kenric: he’s the guy that hires him to go break somebody out of prison
James Roland: Got it. Oh,
Kenric: and then they double cross him. Of course.
James Roland: Yeah. You know, I honestly have to say, I don’t remember where,
Kenric: That’s all good.
James Roland: but like look at the cast. There’s so many people.
Kenric: Oh, it’s crazy. It’s wilderness, Abraham bin Ruby, Leslie Bibb, Mark Boone, junior Cameron Bowen Clayne Crawford, who just had that really good run on lethal weapon in the series, but then got fired because the guests, um, him and Damien wanes didn’t get along when you put it that way. Uh, Patrick Fugit who was in almost famous.
And then he just did the, uh, uh, not the HBO, but the, uh, what’s the other one. One of the premier cable channels. And he did the, uh, who’s the guy John who came up with the walking dead. [00:29:00] We met him
John: Robert Robert Kirkman.
Kenric: Robert
James Roland: Oh, yeah, he did that TV show about possession. Yeah.
Kenric: Yep. And Mary Pat Gleason, who is a classic character actress, John Hawks, who was for people who know eastbound and down, he plays the brother.
And Nick Offerman. Nick Offerman is one of my favorite favorite actors. And he’s so funny in the movie. What’s the movie with Jennifer Anniston and, uh, the Saturday night live alum and they go across country. They’re going to Mexico to sell drugs out of the
James Roland: Oh, that’s right. I don’t remember the name, but yeah.
Kenric: just the scene where offer him and his wife are swingers and they go into their tent. And he’s like sticking his finger in the dude’s ear. And it was like, I lost it. I was like, Oh my God. But it just goes on and on and on all the people that worked on this movie. It’s crazy.
James Roland: I’ll look it up. My whole Mark Boone. I, I don’t know his name, but yeah. Mark Boone was also in, um, sons of anarchy, right?
Kenric: yeah. Yeah. That was the other, that was the other big one that he did. It was saying. Yeah. Sons of [00:30:00] anarchy. Yep.
James Roland: I remember him now. Jesus get no, he’s really good.
Kenric: Yup. Yup. He’s a great character actor, man. How did you, how did you pitch blood drive?
James Roland: blood drive. How did it, it started as a joke, like as a pun, uh, and, and me and my friends would talk about. Um, we should go out in the desert and just shoot, you know, shoot it, shoot a little indie movie kind of thing. And, um, and of course that never happened. And so, but for years they would bring it up and go, Oh my God, I love that.
And then I, um, I managed to snag a manager, uh, with a, with another script that I wrote. Um, and when you get a manager, like the first meeting is always like, great, what else? What else can you do? Um, And so I pitched him a lot. I just did like six things and he picked one or two and said, go work on those.
And literally, as I was leaving, I said, um, I hadn’t, no, I have this other [00:31:00] random idea. Let me just, before I leave or run it by you. I mean, I’m not like, sounds like hyperbole. A really was, I was standing in the doorway and I said, it’s called blood drive. It’s about a car race where all the cars run on human blood and as a.
For the first time I said, yeah, it’s like, it’s a Grindhouse television and my manager just lit up and he goes, I could sell that. I could absolutely sell that. Right. That, um, and then I, I went home and it’s one of those things where you’re like, yeah, that makes sense. Like, it’s a silly premise, but like it’s funny.
And like, whatever. And then you go to write it and you’re like, how do you keep it from being a Saturday night live skit? Like, you know,
Kenric: Cause there’s so far out there.
James Roland: it so far out there, and it’s obviously going to be silly. It’s not going to be serious, but also you don’t want to phone it in. You don’t want it to just be like, just highlight.
Basically my main question was like, how do you care about anybody on the race? Like if everybody’s just murdering [00:32:00] people, it’s fun to watch for 20 minutes, not like a whole season. Um, and that’s where the idea of Arthur came from. And.
Kenric: character development, the producers, the directors, the writers that you guys all use, they did a really good job on taking this. Like you said, a silly thing, but they made you care about the characters. And as you go through you forget how. Outlandish the, yeah. How L like the first episode is to me is the most outlandish.
Cause that’s when you see her kill somebody and stuffed them into her engine, right after that, it becomes kind of like, yeah, the, well, the, the, the cars run on blood. You don’t even like it. Cause everything else starts to happen. And you have so many nice twists and you have so many like weird things that happen.
Like in a, I don’t know, in a really scary way, I guess, is the best way to put it for me. Cause I was like watching it, like the whole scene of her going into the, uh, The Chinese restaurant near the
James Roland: no. Yeah,
Kenric: Those are freaky. That was a freaky episode.
James Roland: Oh yeah. With the weird, y’all the weird stuff going on and yeah.
Kenric: And then you forget about all the silliness and you [00:33:00] just kind of get lost in the show. And I think that’s what most of the real fans are like, loved about it because you have this awesome silliness that happens that makes you laugh and makes you have fun with it. And then there’s this underlying seriousness of it as you go through.
And, and it’s, it’s, it’s a, it’s a, it’s a show about a family.
James Roland: It’s my kind of, yeah, it is like it’s like fast and furious. Yeah, absolutely. No. Um, yeah, no, it was our goal was that if yeah, you buy into the premise and. Our goal, always, this was like the world. The universe worked a certain way. That was outlandish. But within those rules, It was just a story like, like you, the characters had to be properly motivated and they had to background stories that were interesting and fun.
And you had to, you had to care, you know, and yes, in a very arch way. Cause it’s like a comic book world, but, but in the instant, you and we always said that the craziness factor. It was a [00:34:00] safety net, but it can never be a crutch. I mean, if we failed at the story, at least it would still be kind of fun and interesting and weird to watch, but we could never just depend on that because the instant you did that it would just be bullshit, you know?
So we worked really, really hard and, but it just played by different rules. It just played by comic book rules, you know? Um, so, and I remember when we hit on, you’re talking about episode nine. I remember when we hit on. Like, what was Arthur’s backstory going to be? And I knew it was going to be something dark and this and that general ideas and it, and it all came together.
And when one of the writers kind of pitched though, it’s the, the diary and the journal he’s been writing in, it was given to him by the, you know, by the cops, sorry, spoiling. And, and, and it was like, and it just clicked. And we’re like, Oh, like, That’s like ridiculous. You know, that the conspiracy was passed on by a cop.
It just happened to me. Like that’s a comic book, story point, these ridiculous. But within [00:35:00] those rules, it was actually kind of poignant. And you realize this is a guy motivated by guilt, and this is a guy motivated by he’s always been dark AR we likened it to like, be like, uh, you know, some people that are alcoholics and are sober, but then go and work in a bar, you know?
Um, You know, or, you know, uh, you know, uh, you know, pedophiles become priests, right? It’s like you like it, not all of them gotten it, but I mean, you know, although sometimes it does seem like all
Kenric: them, you know, just a couple of them.
James Roland: I did not, not that just to be clear, like the character of Arthur is not a pedophile, but he’s, we kind of treated him like was addicted to violence.
And so he became a cop to stop violence, but he gets to do it by being violent. Right. So like there’s a contradiction there. Like there’s a, you know, um, anyway, and so like, I actually find that stuff really interesting and, and, and, and fun. And then you just kind of get to filter it through this Gonzo lens of.
Like ultra violence and like ridiculous plot points, you know? [00:36:00] So yeah.
Kenric: Yeah, it’s, it’s the, the whole, see where he’s a crucified. Gotta make it when you bring it all around and you look at the story as a whole, it made a lot of sense. You’re like, Oh, I totally get it.
James Roland: Punishing himself.
Kenric: Yeah, he’s totally punted himself all within his own mind. And then he goes through and then that, that was the shocking turn when he becomes Primo.
You’re like, Oh dude, you’re a Dick.
James Roland: was right. Eight it’s like he, yeah, he gave, finally gave in to who he’s always afraid he would be. And he buddy, buddy, buddy bottled it up for so long that he went too far like that. You know what I mean? Like that’s what happens when you kind of deny your true nature. Um, and so he, yeah, no, all of that was, yeah.
I thought I remember when that was, that was not my idea. That was pitched to me by John lab, uh, who runs, uh, who ran the show shooter. Um, It was the showrunner and this, and he goes eat. Cause I, cause I knew Arthur wanted to get darker, you know, like how and how far and you
Kenric: You ran the risk of being captain [00:37:00] America. You guys did a really good, fine line of tipping them one way.
James Roland: yeah. Kind of, yeah. And we kind of trickling, but we got to the point where it’s like, okay, like I wanted him to like become a killer and it was ha and I can’t, and, and. And John pitched the idea of like he wins and the jacket comes down and then, and then he goes into the next episode. He’s a totally different character.
Was like, can we do, I literally said to John, like, can we do that? And he, and he looks at me like, what do you mean? Can we do it it’s blood? Or have you seen what we’ve written so far? Oh my God. You’re right. Like it even scared me.
Kenric: at first, when it first happened, James, at first I was like, wow, that was really quick. Why did he, you know, he was so one way, but then as you, when you think about all the lead, all the episodes leading up and they, and you guys hint at his addiction at violence a lot.
James Roland: at it again. It’s it’s because we wrote all the scripts in advance. We could sprinkle, we had the luxury of sprinkling that in. So it’s all foreshadowed from the first [00:38:00] episode.
Kenric: yeah. I took it as w when he, when he. Makes that massive turn. And I mean, it’s just a spoil it for John A. Little bit, but not really, John you’ll you’ll
John: It’s okay. It’s okay.
Kenric: twist is, is yet to come. And actually you’re going to call me when it happens. You be like, Oh my God.
John: I’m sure I will.
Kenric: But, um, when he turns, I took it as somebody who has a very addictive personality and they tried meth for the first time.
James Roland: got it. Yes.
Kenric: know what I mean? And they just fall off the deep end quick.
James Roland: That’s exactly what happened. And it was kind of motivated by what happens to grace, but it turns into something else and yeah, and no, and that was, yeah, that, that was one of the riskiest things that we did. And I was so impressed with how the fans went with it. They got it. They kind of went, yeah, no, I get what you were doing.
I get. At first it’s weird. Cause it’s so, uh, like it, I mean, cause well, and that’s the benefit of making this ridiculous show where it’s like, literally just snap your [00:39:00] fingers and somebody becomes a villain. Like it happens that quick, you know, but if you look at it and you’re like, Oh no, it’s there. It’s purposeful the
Kenric: been there the whole time.
James Roland: Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.
Kenric: it’s and then it gives you the redemption qualities that you get in the last couple episodes.
James Roland: Well, and if you look at him in the last two episodes, he doesn’t go back to being the Arthur that he was before.
Kenric: No. No, he’s he’s he’s more gray.
James Roland: He’s more right? Yeah. He’s exactly. And it’s yeah, it reminds me, I’m not saying it is this good because it was brilliant, but it reminds me of the last episode of the twin peaks season three, where if you’re, if you’re really, um, if you’re really watching, um, uh, um, Oh, Hey whiskey.
Thanks for frying my brain. Um, Uh, agent
Kenric: Oh, what’s his name?
James Roland: Y comma Laughlin’s
Kenric: Kyle McGlaughlin.
James Roland: Yeah, but his character is, why am I, why am I spacing on like one of the most famous, [00:40:00] Oh my God, no, one’s going to respect me.
Kenric: The FBI agent. We’ll edit it out. James. We’ll miss we’ll we’ll we’ll we’ll look it up and then we’ll make it sound like you just said it.
James Roland: I just forgot the name of like one of the greatest characters ever created. But, um, but if you watch him, you know yeah.
Kenric: Dale Bartholomew Cooper.
James Roland: that’s right. Dale Cooper, God, um, who he is and after they rejoin or whatever, like it’s, it’s, um, It’s well, he is briefly, but when they go, when they, when the universe has joined or whatever happens at the end of it, that character you see at the end, he’s a blend of the ultra good.
And the ultra bad, um, which is that, that was after, after our show, that’s not where we got it from. It was from before, but like reminds me of that. Like an Allen really pulled it off and we were like, wow, this really is. If you’re really watching the performance down to the inflection of his voice, he really, really brought it.
Kenric: guy is great. He’s not just a pretty face he’s. I think he’s really good. And you see a lot of people that go [00:41:00] through and you’re like, Oh yeah, he’s not bad. But that guy, I think he pulls off emotion really well. I think he’s, he’s like convincing when he’s playing. Like, I kind of felt like the first, like the first three or four episodes, he was very much captain America.
James Roland: yeah.
Kenric: And then he slowly starts to, then you start seeing, um, you know, well, you guys have all the addiction, um, pointers out there, you know what I mean? But he’s trying so hard and he’s just talking about how you can’t murder people. You can’t do this, you can’t do that. You know what I mean? Everything’s white, white, white, white, white.
And then he, you know, he slowly goes into the black. And then of course, a full turn and then he’s back then he, then he’s right, right in that middle range, which I thought was great, but that, but Alan man, that guy was great. I was, I was impressed,
James Roland: Yeah, no same here. I was what to find, you know, like one that not like we found, like there was what made us rear, but like, but I mean, literally when he came into the audition room, it was just like, Oh, there’s no, nobody else can play ours,
[00:42:00] Kenric: well, is, does it just piss you off on somebody that pretty, is that talented?
James Roland: Oh, for the echo.
Kenric: jerk?
James Roland: I know he’s he literally is a Ken doll. I mean, it’s absolutely ridiculous.
Kenric: Oh, I love that. She called the Barbie the whole time I was cracking up because he, because there’s a lot of episodes where he literally takes on the girl, like the trope girl role. Where she’s the one saving him? She’s the one kicking everybody’s ass. She’s the one being the, the prototype a protagonist
James Roland: yeah. Kind of, but it’s we? Yeah, because she is, we realized that early on, because we were like, Thematically, like in dramatically, he works as a character in this scenario because it’s like, okay, what’s the scenario? The scenario is, you know, a race, you know, where you’re you’re for, you know, where you got to go kill people to survive.
Right. Well, who’s the opposite of that. Who’s the most interesting person to throw into that scenario is somebody who doesn’t want to kill. So you go, okay, great. Like that’s a story. Then you go to write it and you go to write it. And what happens is character goes, no, I don’t [00:43:00] want to, no, I don’t want to do no, I don’t want to.
And that’s true to his character. But it’s really hard to write a character that just keeps not wanting to do
Kenric: right, right. It gets
James Roland: the whole you born and, and, and because he’s not meant to be alone now you pair him with grace and all of a sudden, both of, and without him. He’s more one note, two, she’s more fun, but she’s also one note, you know?
Right. And so, but then you can find them and all of a sudden, both the characters come alive because she forces him to keep going and have like care, you have progression. Right. But then they constantly have something to bicker and talk about and, and needle each other on because they have conflicting ideology.
So it’s like the odd couples and it, you know what I mean? It really, it really, it really, once we hit on that pairing, we’re like, Oh, we know what the show is. She keeps the plot moving. Right. He’s the, he’s the concepts. So he’s really the sidekick, even though he’s active and he has his moments, he’s really the sidekick, even though he’s the main character,
Kenric: Right, right. I guess it’d be more Bucky.
James Roland: kind of, yeah.
A little bit. Yeah. Bucky had more, more scenes.
Kenric: What’s funny [00:44:00] is Christina Cho. I was just thinking about this, cause we’ve been talking about it the way she plays. Grace is great. And I can’t help to think is she felt like a classic movie star in that role. And when, I mean, classic, I mean like Robert Mitchum, I mean, John Wayne, Steve McQueen, you know what I mean?
That’s the swagger that she has as she’s playing grace. It’s it really is a revelation when you watch her in that role, because it’s so different. And so much more fun than a standard TV show where maybe the girl is the hero or the heroine, whatever you want to call the hero. And you know what I mean?
But they don’t, I don’t know her swagger was, was dead on for grace. I couldn’t even see anybody ever playing that role like that.
James Roland: She commands the camera, you know, I mean, like from that, that first scene that we did with her, when she has to like, You know, it was sorry pal got a top off and she flicks the knife and strikes the pose and she has to be scary and [00:45:00] sexy at the same time and not look stupid. You know what I mean? And like, she flicks that blade and you’re just like, Oh my God, like I’m or the finale that in the, not to spoil anything, but that slow push in of her crying.
In the finale when she’s watching, you know, what she’s watching happen? Um, try not to spoil it, but, um, and I remember watching that on the monitor and all that while David was filming it and going like, Oh my God, she just like, yeah, she could even carry, carry a whole thing just in her closeup. Yeah. She’s amazing.
Kenric: She’s awesome. I would love to talk with her cause she was, yeah. She, she, like, if you had anybody else in that role, I don’t think that show would have been the way it was. There’s no way.
James Roland: no, they’re the weird chemistry that goes on. It’s one of those things, whenever you go to shoot or make anything like this, because it’s one thing on paper, then it’s another thing when you go to do it and you’re just sitting there going like. How did we get so lucky down to like, dude our, [00:46:00] our, um, our production designer down in South Africa, who’s doing, um, he’s doing props or I don’t know if I could say, ah, well, whatever he’s doing, um, halo right now.
Uh, yeah. Right. But he, um, he, um, was the prop master on, um, on a fury road.
Kenric: Oh, cool.
James Roland: And so like, and
Kenric: That makes a lot of sense.
James Roland: If you know, any, anything about fucking filmmaking, the production design and the props and the craftsmanship on display in fury road is unprecedented.
Kenric: it’s
James Roland: I mean, it’s, uh, it’s on a, it’s on another plane. Um, and when I found out that he did that, I was like, Oh my God, you are like, Fucking guy and he, and, and he treated it well, he treated it like it was his Opus that was going to win them all the major awards.
I mean, he did. And, and Danielle
Kenric: guys land that guy? Jesus.
James Roland: a South Africa and they, they [00:47:00] like to work and he’s, he had, didn’t have as much production designer experience because he did mostly props. So the production designer is, you know, it’s a larger capacity, are the blood, you know, and, and. We add, believe it or not.
Yeah, you’re right. How did we land at me? So talented. We had to basically work and work and work to convince the studio to let us hire them because they were like, he hasn’t done enough stuff. And we’re like, we’re like props on fury road is as complicated as like making a smaller movie all on your own.
Like that’s how, like this guy is
Kenric: you’re a is so fucking good.
James Roland: it’s unreal. It’s unreal. And Danielle who he’s good friends with, she did all of our costumes and like her entire department. They, they do. They, they mirages costumes, AKI. Those were handmade. They handmade all of that stuff. Custom they’re like hand stitching leather, almost all the costumes are handmade.
It’s unreal. All of the warrior women in episode six and whatnot. Like
Kenric: Yeah. The Amazon
James Roland: like a, yeah, they made all of those. Like they were [00:48:00] like, um, All, all of the mass and all of that. So like, it was the artistry on display. It was like we had such an incredible group, such incredible crew you’re on levy, went on, he was our cinematographer, just a mad genius.
And he, um, he went on to do, he’s doing black summer right now. You’ve seen black summer on, um, on Netflix. I highly recommend I’m not, I’m the kind of burned down on zombies, as much as I loves all these. It’s like, how much can you handle? But like, But like I’m a black summer. They just keep coming. Right.
Anyways. So like he’s
Kenric: it’s like a zombie hoard. They just keep coming.
James Roland: I know we can’t get rid of
Kenric: star is a summer though. Was the one that introduced like the fast on me, people were like this isn’t right.
James Roland: Oh, for that. Oh yeah. Well they, yeah. And like Canada, but,
Kenric: speaking of hockey though, what was, uh, how and I hope I can say her first name, right? Is it Miranda?
James Roland: motto. Yeah.
Kenric: Mama that girl, she, so she’s a robot or [00:49:00] Android with
James Roland: a sentience sex robot.
Kenric: yeah. Cynthia sex robot. But when you, when she goes through her transformation,
James Roland: Oh
Kenric: The actress needs to be very like
James Roland: She did it.
Kenric: rigid. Like she has to fake me in a police officer and then she has to be rigid and she’s doing all this stuff.
And then her character completely changes. That’s a lot to ask of somebody like that. Of anybody.
James Roland: no, I know she really, she really pulled it off and to do it all in the most uncomfortable costumes, half naked had to like sexually torture people and then, and then turn around by the end and be like a sympathetic character and like had that and just even having to do it, like, like to just say to an actress, right.
You, so your character is a sex robot who has an orgasm for the first time and becomes human because of the orgasm.
Kenric: I love how you find out how that actually happened
James Roland: Oh, yeah,
Kenric: down the road. It’s like, Oh, that’s what happened. That’s so funny.
James Roland: The glitz in the code they’re like, everything would be fine, like, unless you has [00:50:00] an orgasm.
Kenric: Yeah,
James Roland: That was, um, that was a me and David straight and those were our voices. We had two actors play those characters to doctors with the masks on and that flash, but then in, um,
Kenric: guys did a voiceover for him.
James Roland: The audio is too muffled because of the mass.
And so we were like, Oh crap. And so, yeah, David and I went in and like, did that was our, that was our Cammy, our voice acting. Um, we were, we were also the, um, we were also the, the, the gay couple, the parents in the, at the board game commercial, uh, playing the board game
Kenric: Oh, that was you.
James Roland: that David and I, yeah.
Kenric: Oh, that’s hilarious.
James Roland: it straight and was, um, I was the one that, the nerdy one with the glasses.
Yeah. Anyway.
Kenric: that’s so funny. Can Thomas Dominique,
James Roland: Right.
Kenric: most of the time, when you get a sidekick like that, they’re super annoying, right? They’re like whiny. You’re like, Oh my God. They’re just there to, to be annoying. You know what I mean? They move the story along. He’s awesome in it, you know?
[00:51:00] James Roland: You, Thomas was such a God, such a hard worker. He had done a lot. He was in the black mirror. I think he had just shot that. And, um, He, he came, he came on and was like, he’s the guy constantly, or when he wasn’t in the gym, Jesus, that guy worked out a lot. Like, but he I’m like, who else could you believe could beat up Allen registered and at the end, right, it happened.
I’m sorry. Spoiler alert. So like, um,
Kenric: This is for the country, man. You can’t do it. It’s good.
James Roland: a waiver, but he was so, um, so he brought a thoughtfulness to Christopher that honestly, and, and I think I wrote him a note about this and I said, you know, when we went down to start filming. Like, you know, like Christopher was, you know, a less dimensional character than some of the other characters.
And, and, and, and I told them, after the fact, I said, I will be honest. I didn’t [00:52:00] fully figure out that character. And you brought to him cause he’s like thoughtful and kind of, this has Adobe innocence to him in that role. Right. And, um, and I actually wrote a backstory for it. I actually wrote an amazing.
Seen, um, for him in the finale that, that we had to cut out for time, we never shot it. We just ran out of
Kenric: Oh, that’s too bad.
James Roland: and, um, that, where he told a story that kind of, it served as his flashback, even though you didn’t see it, he just talked about it and it kind of retroactively explained why he was so gullible to AKI that was like really heartbreaking and really weird and gross.
Like David Lynch. And it was, we, it was weird. It was like this weird little monologue. And you would have. You want to kill the, I emailed it to, I never, he never got to see it. We had to cut it out. We just knew it wouldn’t work. We didn’t have enough to shoot it, but I emailed it to him like after the show ended and just said, I never showed this to you, but you would [00:53:00] have killed the scene.
But he, he, but that, but I wrote that for the finale, because I had seen, I wrote the finale while we were shooting. So I got to know the characters, voices and stuff, and I. I saw what he was doing with the character. And it was like, and I did, I was like, dude, I didn’t know who Christopher was until you played him.
You brought a humanity to him and a no nonsense kind of thing. And then by that, by the time you get to the end and he’s like, so puppy, dog in love with AKI and you get into like that wacky stuff where like, they think he dresses up like a nerd to like ultra like all that weird, like Looney tunes, shit,
Kenric: right.
James Roland: It is weird. Like, I know I did get him saying that, like I wrote, like we wrote it, but it was like, God, it’s just going to work. It’s so weird. It’s like, let me do it. But
Kenric: totally worked.
James Roland: totally works right here. Totally ridiculous. But it works, but he, um, he’s yeah, no, he’s so he’s so underrated. Um, but he just, he anchors that entire storyline.
Right. Cause you’re just,
Kenric: That’s exactly it. I mean, you just nailed it right there. He anchors that entire [00:54:00] storyline you’re like, like everything else is so far left and he, he, his character never really changes until he feels that he feels that hope a trail.
James Roland: Yes, exactly.
Kenric: And then he’s like, okay, then he comes across like, you know, when you have your best friend in high school and his girlfriend hits on you and you end up having, you guys are drunk, you have sex.
That’s the portrayal that he feels, that’s what comes to me. Right. And you’re like, I’m going to kick this dude’s ass. Cause he just did this. And, and you know, and it makes total sense, you know? I mean, he goes to an extreme and it’s unfortunate that what he does, what he does, but.
James Roland: Yeah, but it works. Yeah, no, yeah, yeah, no.
Kenric: did, how did you, what did you do to sit down and like really just create with these characters? Do they come from people that are, are a more outlandish version of people, you know, or like the gentlemen, that guy who plays the gentlemen is so he’s so good. And he’s so [00:55:00] like you just want to punch him in the face.
James Roland: Huh. Right. Andrew Andrew Hall, who, by the way, um, he passed away last year.
Kenric: ah, that sucks.
James Roland: suddenly out of nowhere,
Kenric: Oh, that sucks to hear that.
James Roland: it really sucks. Um, God, he was a judge. He’s a very well known British actor. He’s a been on a lot of television and in, in, in, in Britain for years and just the kindest, most empathetic person.
I’ve ever met and he just relished playing such an asshole.
Kenric: yeah.
John: I’m good at it.
James Roland: Oh my God. He’s so good. No, it’s um, where did they all compromise? So Arthur had some point. My wife called me out on it. I was talking about, I can’t remember. I was pacing in our apartment talking about the show and I would call Arthur art. I would just call it art for short, it was like, our art does this art does.
That was like a thing I did. It didn’t ever happen in the show. I think maybe all the art, but, [00:56:00] and, uh, and, and, and, and was like, okay. And I’d be like, I’m an art. He like, you know, he’s like this nice guy tried to be good in like the heighten in Los Angeles, which is all like rough and tumble and he wants to be bad.
And he came in and my wife goes, babe, like, You’re like this repressed, conservative Christian that came from out of state move to Los Angeles and then like, had to deal with like the ups and downs and all the weird morality shit that comes into play of like trying to work in Hollywood for years. And then you created a character and, you know, so you could make art and then you’re, you’re walking around and you literally need the character art.
Who’s like dealing with the same shit that was like this weird, like. Oh shit. Like I know, you know, you know, I didn’t didn’t intend that, but she really called me on it and she was like, she’s like, this show is therapy for you. She’s like, basically it was this realization of like, Arthur is me, but in like way better shape and way more handsome.
Um, so, and that was like, Oh, [00:57:00] so like, yeah, he’s, he’s that, that repressed having grown, grown, grown up conservative Christian, like he’s that. He’s a commentary on like, what happens if you were pressed yourself?
Kenric: that’s how I was grown. That’s how I was raised.
James Roland: yeah, no, no, no same here. And, uh, and, and, and it was still religious in a lot of ways, but just have, you know, evolved, you know, um, and have a lot of hangups and baggage because of it.
But the, uh, and so, and then, and then, and grace is almost like the wish fulfillment. And so in ways of, right, like she’s not burdened by contents. Uh, but that’s also her flaw. And so over time she learns, you should have a conscience. And so like Arthur and grace are both wrong and if they need somewhere in the middle, they’d be right.
You know what I mean? They’re like two sides of the same coin. Um, and then slink is kind of like, Every thing you want to say. The thing about slink is that he calls everybody on their bullshit. And so I don’t know if that’s so much to me at this point. I think everybody wants to be that person. Everybody wants to be the smartest one in the room, you know, [00:58:00] but then the thing about slink is that he, um, He’s also totally posturing at the same time.
Like he’s calling everybody else on being false, but he’s the most false one in the room. Right. You know, he’s not even really, it wasn’t even born of anybody. He doesn’t have a belly button. Like all of that was like, it’s interesting. Like he doesn’t. He’s a man with no country Alma, you know, kind of thing.
Um, but there’s a lot, a lot of us linked says is just all of my complaints about the film industry. So there’s a lot of personal stuff in him as well. Um, so I think between slink Arthur and grace, you get, you know what I mean? Like that’s, there’s, there’s a lot of meat. They’re kind of like the three parts of my personality.
Um,
Kenric: of sense. I like how you put that.
James Roland: yeah. Um, and everybody else don’t, well, the Domi and cliff. Are, um, I actually wrote them for, um, some friends of mine. I have married couple that are Apple factors, but then of course we shot it in South Africa and they couldn’t do it. Um, so I, so I wrote that for that, but then they don’t mean any cliff or like what you’re afraid you’re going to be as a married person.
So basically the whole [00:59:00] show and every character is just my psychological bag and it’s just really expensive to therapy.
Kenric: That’s quite the baggage man.
James Roland: Yeah. Well, Often people come to be raised conservative Christian. Um,
Kenric: Do you mind w we were raised so conservative question, Christian. My mom spoke in tongues when she prayed
James Roland: yeah. So you were
Kenric: Roman Catholic
James Roland: Oh, she was wait, Roman Catholic. And she spoke in tongues, which is like the charismatic.
Kenric: yo dude. Yeah, she had her whole program. Did that.
James Roland: Wow.
Kenric: yeah, man. Oh yeah. Wait, one time my sister was having an argument with her friends out in the front yard and she came out and said, you know, in the name of God, disperse
James Roland: Oh, wow. Like,
Kenric: neighborhood.
James Roland: like it was evil, evil spirits. Wow. Wow.
Kenric: Things like that. She was, you know, I love my mom.
She’s good. She’s turning 80 this year.
James Roland: Oh, wow.
Kenric: she is starting to be every bit of, of that old age. It’s unfortunate. It’s hard to watch, you
James Roland: Yeah.
[01:00:00] Kenric: But, uh, yeah. Yeah. Uh, religion played a big part in our, on our household. It broke a lot of things up. It kept a lot of things together too, though. So you, you, you struggle back and forth, you
James Roland: I know I’m the same way. Like it’s, it’s, it’s the same way I’m working on a show now. And it’s my first character I’ve ever, there’s multiple characters in it, but it’s the first time I’ve ever written somebody who’s a Christian because I decided away from it so much because it’s something that I know, but it’s something that I had never really processed.
It’s also stuff that like, I, I. I am not anti religion in any way and still consider myself a religious I’ve just it’s most Christians probably would really take issue, you know, obviously like look at like a blood drive. Um, but I, but, but I’ve always viewed my Christianity very differently, even, even, even when I was much more, um, Um, a conservative or more traditional Christian and, and, you know, it was a creationist and like all of that, I was really steeped in it.
Even [01:01:00] then I was drawn towards the dark things, the horror films, the, you know, um, because it, it, there was a truth in it that I felt like Christian culture, not necessarily the Bible’s dark as hell. Right. You know, but like the Christian culture was ignoring and wasn’t paying attention to, and wasn’t, and that.
And that always drove me crazy. I was like, why, why aren’t you looking at the dark things? Like those are true too. Um, uh, or, or if they are, it’s almost pointed at the wrong thing. Like Christians, Christianity, Christian culture spend so much time like fighting with each other or fighting people because their beliefs are different when there’s like people that believe the same thing as you, that are doing terrible things that you let them get away with.
It just cause they say they believe the same thing as you. And it was like the belief at that point, the belief doesn’t matter, you know, like
Kenric: Right. Wrong is wrong,
James Roland: Wrong
Kenric: it’s extreme.
James Roland: Exactly. So like, what is the, what do we really sorry?
Kenric: well, it’s, it’s like when you look at the archdiocese in [01:02:00] they’re covering up all of the pedophilia that happened and it happened and it’s, you know, there’s a lot of people dealing with it still today and it’s it’s, it was a gross misconduct of power.
And, and, and really a lot of it, I think, stems from them not moving on and evolving with the times. Like, why don’t you let your prescribers married? Okay. That would probably help a lot of that stuff. They’re so repressed sexually,
James Roland: yep. Tradition.
Kenric: what are they surrounded by? They’re surrounded by boys.
They’re surrounded by men all the time and it’s yeah, it’s going to come out.
James Roland: yeah, no, I mean, it’s tough because of then it kind of like throw, like you’re talking about Arthur and grace be an opposite. It’s like it throws everybody into opposite extremes. Right? Because it’s like, tradition is important, but tradition is important only if it is helpful.
Kenric: yeah.
James Roland: So it’s healthy. Exactly. And that’s called balance and that’s, that [01:03:00] comes with wisdom and actually taking time to think about things and, and what happens, what happens with any dog Madison ism? Right. Would you use it as a religious bent, but it can definitely also happen in purely secular or atheistic environments, right?
Where you’re so dogmatic about something that you’re, you can’t see the forest through the trees and that’s when it’s dangerous. I’ll
Kenric: I tell people this all the time, like in Seattle right now. I mean, you’re, you’re in Northwest boy. You know how progressive the Seattle area is.
James Roland: yeah,
Kenric: th and, and inherently, there’s nothing wrong with, like, when it comes to social issues, I’m very liberal,
James Roland: yeah,
Kenric: Like I, I believe, but then when it comes to like fiscal stuff, I can be conservative because I want to hold onto my money.
I worked really hard for what I have, and it’s not like I’m making a million dollars a year. If I lose a hundred thousand in taxes, it’s not a big deal or even $300,000 in taxes. I’m not sweating it. I don’t make that much. You know what I mean? I’m making decent, I’m 45. I’ve, I’ve worked my way up to where I’m at.
But I pay so much out in taxes that, you know, it, [01:04:00] it gets to you, but right now you
James Roland: Yeah, no, I know it’s
Kenric: yeah, you look at the Seattle council right now. They’re all super liberal, super left. There’s no counterbalance voice that says, Hey, we need to look at this differently. Not that you have to be all one side or all the other side, but you need that counterbalance.
And that’s not there right now. And I think that’s true in all of politics. You like, you look at the house, what is it? All Republicans right now? Right?
James Roland: yeah. Or am about the majority.
Kenric: yeah, they’re the majority. And then, and so Trump does something and they just pass it all through and, and, um, you know, we don’t get into politics on here because I think it will get into this, you know, it’s so divisive or decide, you know, it just divides so many people.
James Roland: No, I mean, yeah, I know. I know. I agree. And like, yeah, no, that’s. Yeah. No, I know, but, but I, I agree with you. Like I have, I have really good friends that are super, I’m just super low. Like, look, I’m around mostly, very liberal people here in Los Angeles, but there [01:05:00] is a conservative contingent and, and I was raised much more conservative.
Kenric: Yeah. Yeah. I’m definitely not conservative, but I have some concern conservative tendencies.
James Roland: Oh, absolutely. Yeah. And it, and the fact that there isn’t room for that and the discussion is, is problematic.
Kenric: Oh my God, I didn’t vote for this. I was like, I’ll lay it out there. I didn’t vote for Trump. Right. Because I just didn’t think that I just, I don’t like how he treats people, you know? So, and so I always look, but I don’t vote by party. You know, either I vote for who I think is going to be the better person, regardless of who, what, what can it there or whatever, what part are there with, but at the same time, I don’t have a problem with somebody who thinks Trump is doing a more right than bad.
You know what I mean? And they think, Oh, I voted for him, you know, as long as they’re a good person, I’m not going to their political views, isn’t going to, isn’t going to affect my view of them.
James Roland: yeah, yeah, yeah, no,
Kenric: have friends that like you like Trump, I can’t even be friends with you.
John: Oh, yeah.
[01:06:00] James Roland: well that’s yeah, that doesn’t help anything it’s but a lot of it depends on too. It’s yeah, it’s tough. I don’t, I, I don’t have a lot of contact with people who, who voted for Trump, but there’s two primary people in my life who voted for Trump. One
Kenric: and your wife. I’m kidding. I’m
James Roland: me and my wife. One of them.
He, you know, wears Trump, propaganda had to
Kenric: Oh, Oh, that’s too much.
James Roland: and well, yeah. And, and you’ll ask him about pretty basic things and he, he won’t hear it. Like he’s, um, I’ve been around people that are literally like have come out of cults and are like dealing with like cultic bully and he’s, he, he, he doesn’t think normally irrationally not saying like, like, and then everybody’s like, Oh no, like I’m not saying that about all Trump voters or whatever, but like for him, it’s definitely an
Kenric: a lot of them [01:07:00] though.
James Roland: Um, there are, I mean, there are, um,
John: Oh, for sure.
James Roland: You’ve seen the rally echo chamber. Absolutely. And then, um, and then someone much closer to me, um, voted for him and like, but then like didn’t even know what he stood for or what he was doing. And, and him and his wife were like huge Trump supporters. And then we were talking with him and somebody said Mike Pence or whatever.
And his wife was like, who’s my pants. She didn’t know the vice president was like, Completely ill informed. And I told him some of the stuff that he’s doing and, and he went pale and he goes, I didn’t know any of that and how I was like, are you fucking kidding me? I am a little skewed on that.
Like, I hear you theoretically, but like, well, but then I also know that it’s only two people, but I’m like, those are like the only two people I’ve met and it’s terrible.
Kenric: Okay. You’re terrifying me
James Roland: Yeah, I know it’s terrible by me, but yeah, I know like it’s, [01:08:00] it’s
Kenric: what? I gotta deal. Like I don’t mind throwing my mom,
James Roland: Oh my God.
Kenric: but I, I, you know, but she cause she’s super religious. And so her only issue she needs to know when she’s voting for the president is if they’re pro-life or pro choice.
James Roland: That was my, the people that were very close to me, that was the deciding factor for them too. It was a four portion.
Kenric: even care about any other issue. Really?
James Roland: And it’s really, it’s really tough because the whole world, the world is not that simple and probably very clear, like, like, like I, yeah, abortion is such a tricky one because it is.
Kenric: I can understand how people get so impassioned by it.
James Roland: It’s an important issue, right? It’s the potential of the lives of potential children. Like it’s a big deal. It’s an important deal. Um, but the, but the, but the, but like you, the people make decisions without talking to people without going through anything. My, and my wife and I went through a [01:09:00] situation where we thought we might have to terminate a pregnancy and thank God we did.
And it was. For for the week that we were in that mode of going, this is a real thing. It completely changed everything about it. Like we saw everything differently because until you in that situation, it’s not that, you know what I mean? Like it’s, it’s, it’s so easy to make a judgment from afar, but then to like take a complicated issue like that and make a decision on it.
And then that’s your only deciding factor in an organism as complicated as the United States of America. Yeah. And then that’s the one that yet it’s very, it’s very frustrating. And a lot, a lot of misinformation too, about like planned Parenthood and stuff. Like it’s, it’s the fact that the anyway, sorry, we, we say we weren’t gonna get into politics
Kenric: Yeah, no, it’s good though. I mean, we don’t get to talk about a lot of this kind of stuff because a lot, you know, honestly, we talked to a lot of people they’re scared to talk about politics or scared to talk about things that could be country strewed, you know, as Oh, you’re prolife or your approach choice.
And I don’t want to hear it now.
James Roland: Yeah. Yeah. Well, well, like [01:10:00] personal it’s also like people like. Like, yeah, no, I’m feeling reticent too, but like, I’ve talked about this with too, like me personally, the idea of abortion is, is, is terrifying and hard for me to wrap my head around it. And that’s my heart. And it’s heartbreaking. Like it literally is.
Right. And, but I vote pro choice because right. Because politics are different than, and it, it, it, it should something so important to kind of be just own. There’s only two often say, you know what I mean, to vote for him.
Kenric: every choice, like when it comes down to that choice, everything is so personal and you don’t know why the person is making the choice they’re making, you know.
James Roland: how do you regulate it? Like, what are you literally, can you envision a scenario where you’re like stopping women and you’re like, like, did you say no in time? Was it rape? Did you change your mind? Like, Oh no, but you say you’re destitute and four can’t afford the baby and I won’t have a healthy life.
And Oh no. Have you checked this many boxes and tried to like, give it up for [01:11:00] adoption this many times? Like this is insanity AIDS impossible,
Kenric: Are you building fuel cells from my blood drive car?
James Roland: Nice. Stay away, bringing up so many people that tuned out now they’re like, well,
Kenric: What is happening? I just want to talk about comics and blood drive.
John: here for the Corey movies and the tits and got this.
James Roland: I’ve looked well. The good news is we just fixed everything. So it’s glad that way. It’s a good thing.
Kenric: So,
James Roland: anyway, go
Kenric: James, do you have. Season two thought out. If, if, if, if we said today, Hey, we got the rights we’re going to build. We’re going to do season two on, on YouTube or Netflix or something like that. Do you, do you have something in mind already? I know we, I know that you’ve said it would be a PR it’d be the prison and it would be called blood rock, but did you already have the
James Roland: we hired us that we wrote 40 pages on it. It’s in my it’s in my closet here somewhere. I have a book. Yeah, we wrote, we wrote 40 pages on it. Um,
Kenric: To ed can’t release it.
[01:12:00] James Roland: Oh, I wish I, I wish I, um, the re no, it could be the read. The reason why I have it is man, I don’t, I have no, I have no plan to do another one. I don’t know how I would right now, but the, um, but there’s things in it.
You’re talking about the spoiler that we doing, that we keep, you know, dancing around. Cause we don’t wanna ruin it
John: Sorry.
James Roland: I have that the, the, the, the first episode of season two would have blown that out of the water and it would it be, and it would be something that I, I, as far as I know, has never been done on television.
And in literally every day, like, I will literally sit there and go like, Oh, fuck. Somebody else is going to do something like
Kenric: right, right. And you can’t even say it because you might have a chance to do something like that.
James Roland: maybe I actually don’t. Yeah, I don’t, I don’t have any other shows thought of yet where I could do a twist like this it’s totally predicated or laid up in season one, but still somebody will do something close to it at some point, because some [01:13:00] people are making so much TV now. It’s like impossible to be
Kenric: We’re in a golden age. People ask me all the time. Have you seen this? No. How can you not be
James Roland: I know there’s
Kenric: There’s so much.
James Roland: I know. But,
Kenric: to work.
James Roland: but yeah, no, but seasoned, seasoned too. Would it have. Got it. Got it. I get, get bummed. When I think about it, it was, it was going to be so much better than season one, in my opinion. And I loved season one, but it was like, it was, it was just going to go to a whole new territory.
We had all episodes to play now. We, yeah,
Kenric: that’s so bombing, man. It’s when did you guys find out that you guys were canceled? What was it like during season one or after season one?
James Roland: it was during season when I announced it right after the finale air. Cause I didn’t. One, uh, because the finale, which again, I know not both of you have seen it, but the finale, the finale was not intended to be final, but there’s a lot of big things that happen. And if you watch the finale thinking there was going to be a season two, it [01:14:00] would, you might have some hope.
If you watch the finale, knowing it had been canceled, I was afraid people would think some of the choices we made were made out of like bitterness. And that was not the intention
Kenric: you, you guys wrote a really tight seasoned though. Like if this was going to be your only season and sadly ended up being, it was still a complete season. One story, you know what I mean?
James Roland: Hey, I really struggle with shows that stretch things out and like, you know, I don’t know why.
Kenric: cliff hanger and then they get canceled and you’re like you son of a bitch,
James Roland: Or they took yeah. Or just took their time to a point it’s like, I love stranger thing, but season one and season two or one season, you know what I mean? It’s like, you can
Kenric: Yeah, totally. Totally.
James Roland: In the broth so much. I really struggle with that. Like who am I to say that makes so much money and they’ve had, and they’re going to, and definitely we’ll just keep throwing money at them to make as much stranger things as possible.
So it’s like, so maybe I’m getting something wrong, but I just, I like things that [01:15:00] feel complete and purposeful and it like, you even look at something to breaking bad. Right. Which was serialized. Every episode had a definitive arc. Every seat had a definitive arc. They were still telling.
Kenric: show is so brilliant.
James Roland: It is. And then it’s easy to bring up as the example, because it’s one of the best things that’s ever been made in any medium.
Like really took that to heart. We want it, we want to see someone to be complete and really, and really challenge ourselves to really come up with something original and different for season two, because. That was just the emo of the show. You know what I mean? Every episode is a different genre on a low bar.
I mean, it was like the most daunting thing I’ve ever done. It was, and I think all the crew, would it feel the same? It was, it was insane.
Kenric: Yeah. I was, I was super bummed, you know, what’s weird, man. On hu. It’s on Hulu, right?
James Roland: is it on Hulu?
Kenric: Yeah, it’s on Hulu. And actually there’s two things I want to tell you about with Hulu one. It’s missing episode seven, nine, and 11. You have to go to Amazon and purchase those. If you want to watch seven, nine, 11.
[01:16:00] James Roland: wait, what
Kenric: Yeah. And
James Roland: I need to get residuals or something. I didn’t even know.
Kenric: how we found it. And then the other thing is this is, there’s something weird and I’ve tried on multiple devices and you can really hear it in the 12th and 13th episode. Um, something’s fucked up with their sound where it’s like ripping or, or, you know what I mean? It’s like staticky, like super static and not like, it’s not like, like it’s a Grindhouse.
So you, you kind of put in that. Static seventies, like, you know, Rick record on or something like that. It’s like, I thought something was wrong with my speakers at first. And it happens throughout the whole. And I noticed now it’s like throughout the whole season there’s times, but it’s definitely not something that I I’d be shocked.
It was something that you guys actually recorded into it. You know what I mean?
James Roland: Oh, no, we had absolute our, our, the head of our post department. She does all that. She does ballers for HBO.
Kenric: this is not on the Amazon ones. That’s why I’m like, it has to be something with
James Roland: So it has to be
Kenric: on Amazon.
James Roland: well, I didn’t, I didn’t even know we were on Hulu,
Kenric: better [01:17:00] check your fricking mailman. You better get some
James Roland: Yeah. Well, it makes me happy. It’s on Hulu. Cause people can find it like you did.
Kenric: how we found it. Yeah, we’ll do. I was. I was so happy when, when I started the first episode, we have a chat room cause we ha we actually, James, we actually have like four or five writers, drafting articles doing other podcasts out of nowhere. We started this podcast three years ago and we just, we love it.
You know what I mean? We love talking with people. We just love doing this. And if we could figure out how to do it, Full time and not do our daily day jobs. We would be doing that. But we, for some reason we can’t figure out how to make money with it.
John: That’s the hard part.
Kenric: That’s the hard part. But all these people started coming on.
They’re like, Hey, can we help you guys? So we, we, so Johnny built our website, it’s dot net. And we have people writing on there doing articles that come out every day. And then, uh, this guy, Jeff Haas, who actually booked you for us. And he was like, Hey, I, I am, I have a knack of getting people to interview.
And he’s like, I’ll [01:18:00] come on and be your guys as public relations manager, like sweet. Nobody’s getting paid. You know what I mean? We’re not getting paid, nobody’s getting paid and it’s just doing this out of, out of love. And, um, I’ve kinda lost my train of thought of where I was going with this. I’m not gonna lie.
I totally lost it.
John: I don’t know where you’re going with
Kenric: Yeah. I don’t know where I
James Roland: it was good. I love it. I was, I was feeling blue in the past and though it was like, Oh, my
John: it’s all batching.
James Roland: bigger podcast.
Kenric: passion going, leading at a circle and nothing but a. You know, I w so, Oh yeah. That’s what I was saying. We have this chat room with all these people on. Right. And I started, I was going through hula. I was like, man, I want to watch something different. Cause I’ve been watching all the same stuff lately and I’m, we’re doing a supernatural podcast.
And so I’ve only seen up to season four and
James Roland: Oh, my God, you haven’t. Oh, my God. I’m actually, God, I think I’m three seasons behind now, but on a show with 15 seasons, that’s understandable dude. [01:19:00] Seasoned season five of supernatural is a perfect season of television.
Kenric: Are you, so you’re a huge, do you want to come on? It’s called the moose and squirrel shell, the moose and squirrel podcast.
James Roland: I, you, I haven’t watched it in a, in a while. I,
Kenric: That’s okay.
James Roland: I, I, um,
Kenric: We could just do a supernatural love Fest.
James Roland: I, I, I would, well, I tell you what you want to like, I’m God, I need to rewatch season five. I’m so busy right now. I would love to, but I haven’t watched it in years. I watched it like season five. Like I think when it, we don’t want to error right after error.
So like that’s how long I’ve been a
Kenric: well, this is all, this is all new for me. So I’m watching it. Yeah. Going
James Roland: so lucky. It’s been even after season five. Which is kind of when the show runner left, you know what I mean? And he was like, Donna told my story, you know, it has its ups and downs, but God, they still keep, I mean, I would say at least half the episodes each season are great,
Kenric: Yeah, it’s just, it’s a fun ride.
James Roland: Yeah.
Kenric: It’s a fun ride. So we’re doing that, but I was [01:20:00] like, man, I’ve been watching all these shows. I got it. I need something different. You know what I mean? And I’m going through and I’m like blood drive. What is that? And I’m like, Oh, it’s an, it’s a show. So I watched the first one.
I’m like, what the fuck is this? I was like, who wrote this? This isn’t, this is crazy. And so I’m sending the trailer over to everybody and they’re like, what the fuck are you watching? And Johnny goes first. He’s the first one that was scripted because I am turning that on right now.
James Roland: Yeah.
Kenric: And that was it. And then he goes, He reaches out to Jeff and says, can you think you can get James to come on?
I mean, you know, cause you never know. And I’m like within the same day you agreed.
James Roland: Oh, yeah, no, no, no. Cause I happened to get an alert from the blog and I mean, in the start answer is, is like ever since we’ve been, can’t like the joy of this show is like, look, it did not reach the amount of people that we wanted it to reach.
Kenric: Yeah. It’s the cult status, man.
James Roland: Yeah. I’m hoping. So. And, and. And afterwards it was [01:21:00] really demoralizing because the only, that’s why I’m excited about it being on Hulu, even if it’s in a terrible form, uh, because, um,
Kenric: reach out to them and say, Hey, something’s wrong with my audio on this?
James Roland: Well, I will.
And I’ll, I’ll, I’ll reach out to universal and, and, and, and see what’s going on. I will be honest, it aired with not the best sound either. There was something in the compression. I didn’t like lists. I listened to every episode in the mix and it was incredible. We had some of the best sound guys in the industry working on it because, uh, Janice, our, our, our, our post producer is, um, I mean, absolutely incredible.
I mean,
Kenric: the last eight minutes of episode 12, you’ll hear, you’ll hear a predominantly, so you’ll see. You’ll see. You’ll hear what I’m saying.
James Roland: No.
Kenric: know, check it out.
James Roland: So, but anyway, but even in a terrible form, I like the idea.
Kenric: like puts into that whole Grindhouse thing though, man.
James Roland: Yeah, I know [01:22:00] exactly. I say might be perfect, right? Like.
Kenric: It’s dude, I don’t know, man. You, you made a show. That’s going to last, I think. And it’s going to have a cult following for a long time. I’m shocked that I don’t see people cause playing it, you know, because slink is just begging to be cause played.
James Roland: I’ll send you guys some links. There’s a, there’s a gentleman. Andy, Andy Turner, I think is his name in England. And he’s like a genius link cost bucks. But there were some during the, during the, during the time. But the problem was, is it’s been really hard to get and for people to find like you could buy it on iTunes, but who’s going to buy a show on iTunes that he never seen.
You know what I mean for like
Kenric: it on Hulu. If you have a Hulu subscription, you’re good to go.
James Roland: don’t no, that makes me happy, man. That’s that’s what more people and thank you for like, sharing the word about it. Like that’s what it takes is just like word of mouth and people to go. What the, what the hell is this? You know, um,
John: I wish we knew back when it came out to share back then
Kenric: yeah, yeah, me too. Cause we were active in Tucson in 2017.
John: they’re brand new, but yeah,
[01:23:00] Kenric: Yeah, we’re a brand new, but still,
James Roland: dude, better, late than never. And at least it’s cool now because it’s
Kenric: maybe universal go like maybe we should take a second. Look at this. People are really liking it. I mean, it happened to family guy.
James Roland: Yeah. I mean, that’s, that’s really, what it’ll take is, is word of mouth building over time. And that happens through people talking about it, um, and then having access to it. So if it’s on Hulu, that’s a, that’s a step up for us.
And then.
Kenric: don’t tell me, because I’m gonna, I’m gonna hold some hope that, that something happens like a movie or a season two does go into fruition because hopeful that, uh, slink can come back. I have some, some ideas of how you would do that. And I don’t want you to tell me if he does or doesn’t, you know what I mean? Cause um, you just never know
James Roland: yeah,
Kenric: that’s universal. I know it’s getting pretty late. We should probably wrap up, but has universal, uh, ever thrown a number out at you?
James Roland: Had thrown a number out at me. What do you mean for
Kenric: to buy the rights back.
James Roland: they are, I actually don’t know what the number was. Cause my representation [01:24:00] we’re handling all of that.
Kenric: they’re like neon. No,
James Roland: But it wasn’t even to buy the whole thing. They were basically saying that we could buy back permission, like the rights to use certain characters in the second season.
Kenric: you need all of it.
James Roland: I
Kenric: need
James Roland: that. Well, well, yeah. And it was like, yeah. Oh, if I’m looking on Hulu, now it looks like it’s on Hulu plus live TV. So you must have the live TV,
Kenric: Hey, do you have to have the live TV for
James Roland: That’s why. Yeah. So it’s not actually streaming. So you have to have, you probably have like, in the package, like, um, Saifai
John: but why, but why did they have episodes nine, 11 and
Kenric: seven, nine and
John: 11, right. They skip it
James Roland: cause it’s a mess and they don’t care. Um, no, I did. Yeah.
Kenric: it’s
James Roland: I mean,
Kenric: but it’s not very expensive on Amazon prime either. It’s only two 99 an episode.
James Roland: Yeah, no, it’s not. The thing is it’s got to already be a fan of the show to know you want to spend that money on it because how much spendable income do people have? You know, these days, not a lot, you know,
Kenric: I think we should push and push and [01:25:00] then do a couple of other things to try to tell people about this. Cause. Honestly, James, I, I really appreciate you coming on. This is it’s, it’s a joy to have you on, and I hope that we can entice you to come back. Cause you’re just fun to talk with.
James Roland: Well, thanks guys. This was, yeah, this is a blast. And it means, honestly it means a lot like, um, The to, to, to talk about the show and find people that see it and love it. And because like, it may not have been a ton of people, but like do the people that are into the show are passionate. They’re still active on the Facebook forums and
Kenric: Yeah, but it’s so good. That’s why I think everybody’s just hoping that Saifai and universal get off their butts and say, wow, we really do need to do a season two, because that was a dumb move to cancel it.
James Roland: For the, yeah, I hope so. We’ll see. Maybe we’ll get lucky. I haven’t heard anything about peacock, which is their new streamer, but,
Kenric: Oh, is that what it’s called? Peacock?
James Roland: he, yeah, they’re they’re yeah, they got to do streamer called peacock.
John: They’re going to regret that name.
Kenric: my cut. Cut. Cut. My peacock.
James Roland: Not saying anything to my corporate overlords, they can, [01:26:00] but yeah, like I can tell you that if season two of blood drive was on peacock. Oh my God. We’d have fun with that name.
John: Yo. Yeah, be so great.
Kenric: James, thank you so much for coming on. Uh, and man. Good luck, man. I hope this, I hope that all works out at some point. And if it, if not, I can’t wait to see what you do next beyond just working on like the purge and all that. But coming from the mind of James Rowland
James Roland: thanks so much. You guys know, I read that and that means a lot. I appreciate it. Thanks for supporting the show and, um, dude, reach out to me when you, um, when you, when you see, when you see the, the finale, I want to know what you think.
John: Oh, I will. I will.
James Roland: Ah, yeah. Um, yeah, it means a lot. You guys, thanks so much and, um, check out your podcast.
Kenric: Cool. Thanks, man. I’ll talk to you soon.
John: a good
James Roland: All right, man. Have a good night. You guys. Thank you. That was fun.
[01:28:00] [01:27:00] Kenric: I just totally slapped it,
John: Slap it to mic.
Kenric: slapping the base. [01:29:00] Well, that was a lot of fun.
John: Did I had so much fun to interview talking with James and his passion for the show match our passion for watching the show.
Kenric: Yeah. You know, and it’s so bumming that it got canceled
John: super bumming,
Kenric: and it’s like, you know, he’s bombed, the fans are bombed everybody’s bummed.
John: All a little bump bump.
Kenric: And honestly, I wish universal will just give him the rights so that he can continue it somewhere else. Why hold onto it to me, it’s like, if you cancel it during the first, that should almost be like a, in the contract of creators.
If they get counseled in the first season, then all the rights should revert back to them, you know, and, and maybe keep the rights for them to be able to play or stream that first season, as much as the universal, whoever owns the rights wants. Right. But the. Creators should be able to take it and pitch it somewhere else to be able to maintain it and keep it going.
John: Yeah, I agree. I think that’d be, that’d be, that’d be great. Cause [01:30:00] I mean, a season two, a blood drive on blood rock would have been phenomenal. And I sent this, I sent the trailer the same one. You sent me over to my buddy Scott. He responded within like a minute going less than seconds. End of the trailer.
I’m all in on this. That’s all it took.
Kenric: Yeah. It’s so good. It’s so fun. And. I don’t know if you like over the top stuff. Is it gory super gory? Is it violent, super violent. Is there a ton of sex? Yeah, there’s a ton of sex. I mean, the first episode ends with them having to get their adrenaline up. So they have sex going across the finish line
John: Back doors. Open one time. Good deal. Bambi.
Kenric: Yeah.
John: That by far is one of my favorite lines from a TV show in a long time.
Kenric: man. It is so funny. It is just, I don’t know, but at some point. James wrote such a I don’t, to me, he wrote a very tight story. And as you go through it all the, over the top violence and Gore kind of, even though it’s [01:31:00] still there kind of slides away and you’re more engrossed and more in tune with what the story is, what the story is telling you and trying to get in front of figure out what’s going on.
John: Right, right. It just, and as you heard, I have not finished the show yet, but I’m going to finish it very soon. So I can actually talk about the twist ending, but I’m kind of sad that I hadn’t finished it. We couldn’t talk about it on the show, but it kind of makes me even more invigorated to finish, to watch it and see what that is.
Kenric: Yeah. It’s a lot of fun. All right, guys. I hope you enjoyed that. I mean, we just had James rolling on, created a blood drive on how awesome was that.
John: It’s pretty freaking awesome.
Kenric: And keep your ears open. Cause we have more coming and if you like interviews and you liked that stuff, go check out our back catalog.
There’s a lot of stuff in there.
John: There’s so much stuff. There’s so many interviews, so many fun episodes that we do. There’s a bunch of other episodes. We just launched a new show.
Kenric: Yeah.
John: All about supernatural called moose and squirrel a supernatural podcast, but we’re going through in two parts per season talking about supernatural because it’s an amazing show.
Kenric: All right [01:32:00] guys. I think we’re out.
John: We are out. We are done. It is late. I am tired. I have to go to the store and get my wife, Graham Cracker. So I’m taking you with me. That’s and I’ll have to ARD
Kenric: No, you guys go, Hey, don’t forget to open the mine.
John: read more.
[01:35:00] [01:34:00] [01:33:00] Kenric: Hello?
James Roland: Hey, how you doing?
Kenric: Good. How are you?
James Roland: Pretty good.
Kenric: Well, thanks for coming on.
James Roland: I don’t know how good my microphone is.
Kenric: Yeah, it’s a little scratchy, but that’s okay. We’ll deal with it.
James Roland: let me might be on my head from microphone. How is that? Is that better?
Kenric: I can’t tell the difference to be honest.
James Roland: sorry. So you’re in, um, So you’re in Bremerton.
Kenric: We were we’re from Bremerton, but we’re actually in maple Valley right now.
James Roland: Oh, nice. I’m from, um,
Kenric: Tacoma, right?
James Roland: Tacoma. Yeah. And I, um, Tacoma area, I mean, um, Pew, Allah, and, uh, uh, and until I was 12 and then, uh, still a gum, but I spent a lot of high school time in gig Harbor,
[01:36:00] Kenric: Oh yeah. Nice, nice. It’s it will always be the Puyallup fair,
James Roland: But there will always be, yeah, not this Western Washington nonsense.
Kenric: It’s like, how do you do away with the bul fair theme song? Come on.
James Roland: Yeah, exactly. Right.
Kenric: It’s it’s so fucking iconic. Um, so James, before we start rolling
John: I know.
Kenric: that’s yeah, that pun was unintentional.
John: It sounded super on purpose.
Kenric: it was totally not intentional. So when we, as before we get going, I just wanna let you know, um, we’re a super easy podcast.
We don’t, uh, we’re not out to get anybody like, Oh, say something weird, you know what I mean? Or
James Roland: Oh God. Yeah,
Kenric: Yeah. So if you say anything, like you slip up on something you don’t want to have out there, or you say something that you, that you think is could be misconstrued as something, just tell us it’s gone.
We’ll
James Roland: Okay, cool. Cool. Cool.
Kenric: Yeah. So don’t worry about anything like that. We’re not here to get ya.
James Roland: I go on I antisemitic rant or something. Um,
Kenric: You never know it could, it
James Roland: there’s one but that out, because I
Kenric: Yeah.
James Roland: I should be, [01:37:00] I should be okay. I mean,
Kenric: James, give his best Mel Gibson impression.
James Roland: Um, no, but I, um, I mean, I, yeah, no, no, no, I’m good. I have everything on this show. I think people will be prepared for anything, so it’s okay.
John: Right.
Kenric: right. So, okay. So just, I want to make sure you, did you go ahead, John?
John: I would say also, so, you know, if you don’t want to have your camera on, well, we’re not going to be on our sides. You can turn off your camera if you don’t want it on. Um, and then it’ll record your camera for you, but we’re not gonna use video. So where did we just use audio?
James Roland: I’ll turn it up.
Kenric: Yeah. And then, um, I just wanna make sure I got some things right. To coma Washington. I’m just going to say, I’ll just say Tacoma because people not gonna, no, one’s gonna steal a com unless you’re from here.
James Roland: no, that’s fine. Yeah. I was born at Tacoma general, so it
Kenric: Yeah. And then,
John: Nice. It was my son.
Kenric: Jack was born in Tacoma.
John: No, Cody was
Kenric: Oh, code-less
John: the eldest son.
Kenric: yeah. John has like a billion kids. He’s got a brood.
James Roland: all over the state
Kenric: Yeah. He’s got a brood, five different women, five different kids. [01:38:00] It’s
John: not true, but okay.
Kenric: a, you worked on weeds and weeds. You’re a producer though, right?
James Roland: No, no, that’s a lot of people. No, I wish. I’d be a lot richer. Um, no, I, um, I was a producer as a assistance on a week from season three until the act. Um, yeah.
Kenric: So, um, and then, but you did work on low story and the purge 2018, you’re working on a purge right now, right?
James Roland: Or the I, yeah, yeah. We just wrapped that we aired the last episode of season two in, um, in December. Yeah. Um, and so, uh, yeah, so I would purge, and then I loved arguing with cutters. A love story.
Kenric: yeah,
James Roland: Yeah.
Kenric: of funny. I haven’t watched that one yet. Is it good?
James Roland: It’s you know, it’s it. No, but it’s, it’s, it’s ambitious, but dude, here’s who’s on that cast who at the time had no idea.
Mmm. Mmm. Uh, Oh, I’ve [01:39:00] had, I’ve had a couple of drinks. Sorry, Nick Offerman.
Kenric: I’m having a beer right now. Nick Offerman. No way.
James Roland: I worked with Nick Offerman before had any idea who he was, uh, Leslie Bibb. Um, I’m spacing on his name, even though he’s a genius, uh, from arrested development joke from arrested development. So we’ll, uh, we’ll our net,
John: Oh, will Arnett.
James Roland: net
Kenric: is on there too.
James Roland: You’re good. Yeah, he’s the one I knew Shannon. So someone who was in a Knight’s tale, um, um, uh, yeah, kind of an
Kenric: Boone,
James Roland: dude. You have no idea. Like there were all of these people,
Kenric: Crossfield. What?
James Roland: Ali, the cats is amazing. All these people went on to do so many other amazing things.
Kenric: This is
James Roland: Kay. Up. Yeah. Shea Whigham. Who’s like now in like Scorsese stuff.
Um, who was incredible at the time we were like, man, this guy is amazing. Mmm. But now I know I do John Hawks. Right. Who like went on to [01:40:00] like, get nominated for winter’s bone. Mmm.
Kenric: Tom waits. That’s hilarious.
James Roland: God. You want to hear Tom Boyd story?
Kenric: Yeah, let’s hold this, save it.
James Roland: Oh, okay.
Kenric: Yeah, let’s save it.
James Roland: All right. Sorry. Anyway.
Kenric: Alright, so I’ll just do a thing and then we’ll get going. Cause I got a feeling we’re going to have a lot of fun.
James Roland: Nice. Okay. Cool.